Seized! Driveshaft to Final Drive - only 16K miles

[robinsonjoe]

Hi there random GS strangers/friends! Anyone able to help me please?

I have just been given a "wonderful" bit of news on the old GS. Apparently the driveshaft is seized to the final drive, which means that the final drive can not be opened up and the oil cannot be changed. I am talking here about a 2007 model GSA with only 16K on the clock.

Apparently the only technical repair solution is like this: the driveshaft must be cut to be able to open up the final drive. The final drive unit might need to be replaced if it cannot be dislodged from the stub of the newly-sawn-off driveshaft. And then there is no guarantee that there isn't a problem at the other end of the driveshaft, so there could be a lovely load of gearbox fun and games if t'other end of the driveshaft cannot be removed either.

It would appear as if this has seized since I laid it up in late November '13. I haven't been able to ride since then anyway as I have just undergone a total knee replacement (thanks to an old bike spill, long story, not relevant really!) and I was just getting it serviced and MOT'd ahead of my return to biking now that I am fit enough again.

The bill for this would be about £2K using new parts, more if there is also a gearbox disconnection problem. Knowing BMW parts prices, about the same as a new bike I suspect!

My problem is that I just cannot get a straight answer from the dealer as to whether it is something that I ABSOLUTELY MUST get fixed, whether I can ride it at all, whether is it a genuine safety hazard? Will my bike shred itself at the first bump in the road if I take it out like this?

Apparently this hasn't really happened before. I doubt that, but I can only find a ton of threads/issues about the final drives failing, but none about this seizing problem, so maybe it is rare?

Unfortunately the (main) dealer will not entertain doing the work using 2nd hand parts that I source off ebay for example; whilst to be honest I am not amazingly keen on using unwarranted parts - even though the parts inside my own bike are effectively second hand. I could be replacing a broken part with an about-to-break part.

So....

1) should I worry and try and get it fixed with new parts and spank a few grand (which I don't have)?
2) should I worry a bit, listen for rattles, but leave it and hope/pray it will be OK a bit longer?
3) can I genuinely and safely ignore it?
4) should I be OK going to a reputable independent spanner man and using 2nd hand parts?

Any war stories out there? sensible advice?

Thanks chaps/esses

Big Joe

 

[Sgt Bilco]

Not heard that one before!! I'm taking it the bike rides OK but the shaft is just seized on the FD? It's quick common for a lot of rust to get in there and that would seem to be the issue with it and it obviously hasn't been lubed properly after the last time it was removed.

Depending on where you are, I'd get a good independent to have a butchers and perhaps rebuild it which would make much more economic sense.

 

[Shep]

Does it not need to slide a little for the suspension to work?

I'll agree with Bilco, get a good independant on it if you can't do it yourself.

 

[robinsonjoe]

Wow a response already, impressive, thanks!

I have no idea if i should ride the bike at all. It hasn't been ridden since November as I had to get it collected and delivered back in a van by the dealer (I can not ride quite yet thanks to my knee).

Problem is that I don't understand the detail of the mechanics of the drivetrain and how much flex there is as a result of swing arm movement. I don't know where the "hingeing" happens. As it is a spline connection I assume that it always kept straight and that maybe the driveshaft is where the magic happens?

Yes the lubing of the splines seems to be an issue and dry joints are a common problem - my dry old knee exploded, don't fancy having that happen at 100mph on the autobahn!

I suspect that it is a combination of no/little lube on the splines and maybe a worn/leaking seal between the swing arm and the final drive.

 

[Shep]

Where are you based?

 

[robinsonjoe]

I live in Henley, near Reading. My brother has a van big enough to transport it, so i can get it pretty much anywhere (within reason) if it can't/shouldn't be ridden. I don't know of any good independent GS specialists locally, but more than happy to take some solid recommendations. I am way beyond warranty now and happy to consider main dealers as just a dim nightmare from the past!

 

[Shep]

I live in Henley, near Reading. My brother has a van big enough to transport it, so i can get it pretty much anywhere (within reason) if it can't/shouldn't be ridden. I don't know of any good independent GS specialists locally, but more than happy to take some solid recommendations. I am way beyond warranty now and happy to consider main dealers as just a dim nightmare from the past!

Steptoe on here is the man as far as i'm concerned, he'll be able to give a good honest opinion, he lives in Kingston (not as posh as it sounds but he likes the urban dude image!)

It will take you less than an hour to get to him!

 

[MikeO]

I live in Henley, near Reading. My brother has a van big enough to transport it, so i can get it pretty much anywhere (within reason) if it can't/shouldn't be ridden. I don't know of any good independent GS specialists locally, but more than happy to take some solid recommendations. I am way beyond warranty now and happy to consider main dealers as just a dim nightmare from the past!

I'd have a chat with Steptoe...

Mike

EDIT Dammit!

 

[adventuredon]

Steptoe, London just off the A3 near Kingston/robin hood roundabout is a very fair independent. Actually, way better than fair! have a look for
The GS Shop
5 Vale Crescent
London
SW15 3PJ

 

[Sgt Bilco]

You have Steptoe down in Richmond and he'll be the man to contact.

 

[Shep]

Neil (steptoe) will need a bigger helmet soon!!

 

[Sgt Bilco]

Neil (steptoe) will need a bigger helmet soon!!

Fnaar, fnaar....

 

[robinsonjoe]

Looks like Steptoe is my man then (hope he has a son!). Thanks all, will give him a try and report back if yer interested! In the absence of pointers about riding it with this issue, i think I'll van it over.....damn, i'll owe me Bro. If I had the time, I'd punt it downstream!

 

[Robbo1200ADV]

Worth trying some heat / liquid nitrogen if you can get any and a Fecking big hammer . Nought to loose

 

[DrFarkoff]

Had one of these a year ago

Had to build a Jig and a hydraulic puller to extract the shaft without hammering the schite out of it or heating the Beh-Jaysus out of it either

So as not to damage the FD or the shaft basically

 

[birdseye]

Wow a response already, impressive, thanks!

I have no idea if i should ride the bike at all. It hasn't been ridden since November as I had to get it collected and delivered back in a van by the dealer (I can not ride quite yet thanks to my knee).

Problem is that I don't understand the detail of the mechanics of the drivetrain and how much flex there is as a result of swing arm movement. I don't know where the "hingeing" happens. As it is a spline connection I assume that it always kept straight and that maybe the driveshaft is where the magic happens?

Yes the lubing of the splines seems to be an issue and dry joints are a common problem - my dry old knee exploded, don't fancy having that happen at 100mph on the autobahn!

I suspect that it is a combination of no/little lube on the splines and maybe a worn/leaking seal between the swing arm and the final drive.

At both ends of the drive shaft there are splined joints, so the only way I can see the shaft being seized in is if water has got into the swing arm and the splines have rusted into the socket whilst the bike was laid up.. Its highly unlikely that this has happened at both ends ( water runs downhill) and you should be able to free the shaft at the gearbox end.

Personally I cannot see any reason why the bike should not be used but that has to be your decision. What I would suggest is that you get in touch with Mikeyboy ( he posts here) who has a business repairing bevel boxes and shafts. I've used him and he knows what he's doing.

Have you been using a pressure washer on the bike? That gets water past the rubber boots.

 

[robinsonjoe]

Have you been using a pressure washer on the bike? That gets water past the rubber boots.

Guilty as charged yer 'onour!

Good to hear I am not the only victim of this. Sounds like solid advice. I will ride it to someone for the fix - will try Mikeyboy and Steptoe.

Cheers!

 

[Pukmeister]

Why not try to remove the final drive with the driveshaft still connected to it as Birdseye suggests by undoing the FD knuckle bearings/para lever arm bolt then popping the driveshaft off the gearbox end snap ring/splines and withdrawing through the swinging arm.

Once free from the bike, penetrating oil on the splines then an application of heat and force would be needed (blowtorch and big hammers/blocks of wood) to separate the shaft from the final drive. No need to spend upwards of 2k to cut off and replace the shaft when a decent engineering shop or independent can free a seized set of splines.

 

[Bendy toy]

The swing arm should not be sealed at the bottom end so water can drain out. If it is sealed, some genius at BMW needs a smack.


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[B4ndit]

The swing arm should not be sealed at the bottom end so water can drain out. If it is sealed, some genius at BMW needs a smack.


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It is sealed at the bottom end. Real bad design as I am finding out with lots of grotty rusty water sat in my 2011 GSA drive shaft. Enough to make it a regular service item for me. Drive shafts pfff. Chains are easier to maintain.