ESA default rider weight?

[RedRick Esq.]

Question now is, if I just changed the spring to a heavier spring, lets say 100 kg weight just for safety sake, would the ESA sensors have to be recalibrated by BMW or not...........

Dunno I'm getting a KTM

Seriously why all the worry ride the bike is my advice let the electronics sort it all out for you until they break

Job jobbed

 

[Deleted account 191119001]

Dunno I'm getting a KTM

Seriously why all the worry ride the bike is my advice let the electronics sort it all out for you until they break

Job jobbed

No worries Rick, bike is fine I just ride it and it has given me no troubles yet, it was just that I inherited a brand new set of shocks, and will upgrade the springs on them later, and just poking questions around, enjoy your new steed, they are nice, I just hate chains, a personal thing over the years of having the buggers.

 

[RedRick Esq.]

No worries Rick, bike is fine I just ride it and it has given me no troubles yet, it was just that I inherited a brand new set of shocks, and will upgrade the springs on them later, and just poking questions around, enjoy your new steed, they are nice, I just hate chains, a personal thing over the years of having the buggers.

I suppose that manufactures are limited and have a mass market product with a one size fits all approach or a broad church of settings if you like.

Now obviously the perfct suspension set up is customised to the individual rider and his weight and style of riding but that costs money most are not prepared to spend
My Hypermotard has Ohlins and i spent some money getting them prpoerly set up for me and that was worth every penny but with these new electrickery units there should be no need as they should just sort it all out

 

[Deleted account 191119001]

I suppose that manufactures are limited and have a mass market product with a one size fits all approach or a broad church of settings if you like.

Now obviously the perfct suspension set up is customised to the individual rider and his weight and style of riding but that costs money most are not prepared to spend
My Hypermotard has Ohlins and i spent some money getting them prpoerly set up for me and that was worth every penny but with these new electrickery units there should be no need as they should just sort it all out

Aint that a fact, so much wizardry feel like im at stonehenge..........

 

[Khulu]

I suppose that manufactures are limited and have a mass market product with a one size fits all approach or a broad church of settings if you like.

Now obviously the perfct suspension set up is customised to the individual rider and his weight and style of riding but that costs money most are not prepared to spend
My Hypermotard has Ohlins and i spent some money getting them prpoerly set up for me and that was worth every penny but with these new electrickery units there should be no need as they should just sort it all out

It's the same with the R9T; it's sprung for someone heavier than my 75kg weight so I'll be fitting a Nitron to suit me soon.

 

[Deleted account 191119001]

It's the same with the R9T; it's sprung for someone heavier than my 75kg weight so I'll be fitting a Nitron to suit me soon.

You could eat some pies, way cheaper and you get the Pukka benefit...........

 

[Khulu]

You could eat some pies, way cheaper and you get the Pukka benefit...........

Thanks for the suggestion but I like the weight / shape I'm at!

 

[Deleted account 191119001]

Thanks for the suggestion but I like the weight / shape I'm at!

Fuel efficient weight that is............

 

[Boxerlust]

I don't know what spring rate the ESA shocks have but it can only be a compromise as some riders are light and other ones are fat.
That is the beauty of the ESA/auto system that is levels the bike ride height no matter how heavy the load.
It works pretty well myself being around 100 kilos naked all beer gut and muscle...
I set mine on max/dynamic all the time.Good enough to not have to spend another couple grand on no-ESA compatible Ohlin$ TTX...

 

[keltis99]

Is there any way to adjust the "standard bmw ESA" weight? via some soft/GS911/esys option?

 

[Deleted account 191119001]

Is there any way to adjust the "standard bmw ESA" weight? via some soft/GS911/esys option?

Nope you will have to change the spring, if you need to be more than the 80kg set riders weight.

 

[fred_jb]

Agreed. You could maybe change the preload presets on older bikes, but the current AUTO preload setting takes care of that anyway.

The problem is that ideally you want the exactly correct spring rating for the load you put on the bike, as preload can only mitigate a too soft spring rate by cranking up the ride height to eliminate the resulting excessive sag, but preload does not change spring rate, so it still means the spring may be too soft or even too hard for your particular use, and if you frequently change the load with pillion and/or luggage the spring rate cannot be ideal for all cases.

Having said that, I am always amazed when going from solo riding to two-up with luggage at how effectively the lastest ESA system adjusts to the different loads, despite having to work with a single compromise spring rate. It means the bike's handling seems barely affected by the extra load, and copes better than any other bike I have owned, so I think as well as the auto preload adjustment the system must work some magic with load related damping adjustments.

 

[CPJS]

Nope you will have to change the spring, if you need to be more than the 80kg set riders weight.

On a D-ESA GS changing the spring will end up with the wrong damping values as the system is pre set for the origional spring weight, it may even be much worse off as you will be changing the point at which the auto preload, and variable damping, starts to operate.
You could have the situation of more spring plus more weight of rider with suspension still at its base ride height with very little damping.
This is why the aftermarket suspension for D-ESA is trailing behind with, AFAIK, only TT offering replacement D-ESA shocks.

This does not apply to non dynamic esa as you can manually alter the damping.

 

[Deleted account 191119001]

On a D-ESA GS changing the spring will end up with the wrong damping values as the system is pre set for the origional spring weight, it may even be much worse off as you will be changing the point at which the auto preload, and variable damping, starts to operate.
You could have the situation of more spring plus more weight of rider with suspension still at its base ride height with very little damping.
This is why the aftermarket suspension for D-ESA is trailing behind with, AFAIK, only TT offering replacement D-ESA shocks.

This does not apply to non dynamic esa as you can manually alter the damping.

Wilbers replace the shock and the spring only to suit the weight you need, keeping the electronic parts of the original shock, obviously that would be the same as just changing the spring, would it not, I thought the wizardry could figure out what it needed after that............

 

[fred_jb]

Wilbers replace the shock and the spring only to suit the weight you need, keeping the electronic parts of the original shock, obviously that would be the same as just changing the spring, would it not, I thought the wizardry could figure out what it needed after that............

I imagine the spring rate affects the rate of change of the position of the suspension in response to road surface conditions as detected by the position sensors on front and rear.

Presumably the system is programmed to interpret this motion in the light of what it knows the standard spring rate to be, and it will use this information to calculate appropriate damping settings when these are changed on the fly, supposedly many times per second, by the semi-active suspension.

I would have thought that a change of spring rate without the system being reprogrammed for this would mean that the input information would be misleading and lead to non-optimum damping adjustments on the GIGO computing principle - that is Garbage In, Garbage Out.

 

[Deleted account 191119001]

I imagine the spring rate affects the rate of change of the position of the suspension in response to road surface conditions as detected by the position sensors on front and rear.

Presumably the system is programmed to interpret this motion in the light of what it knows the standard spring rate to be, and it will use this information to calculate appropriate damping settings when these are changed on the fly, supposedly many times per second, by the semi-active suspension.

I would have thought that a change of spring rate without the system being reprogrammed for this would mean that the input information would be misleading and lead to non-optimum damping adjustments on the GIGO computing principle - that is Garbage In, Garbage Out.

Fred Touratech change the ESA shocks ride in and ride out brand new shocks sprung to weight desired, they do not do anything else, I seen it done a few weeks ago, when my mate changed his stock shocks after a 50 km ride to the Touratech warehouse, and he is thrilled to bits, I have a feeling the sensors and wizard box are just like the ECU and learn as they go along, just my opinion.....

 

[fred_jb]

Could be the ESA system just has some sort of target for smoothing out suspension movement which might mean it is fully adaptive with respect to spring rate.

 

[Deleted account 191119001]

Could be the ESA system just has some sort of target for smoothing out suspension movement which might mean it is fully adaptive with respect to spring rate.

Tis my thinking but I do not have a 100% sure answer, however a bike at that price must have some hidden extras.

 

[CPJS]

Could be the ESA system just has some sort of target for smoothing out suspension movement which might mean it is fully adaptive with respect to spring rate.

Spring rate is not the issue it is the relationship between that and damping, the TT shock will be damped to suit the spring and it is manually adjustable so you can set you own base setting and let the D-ESA do its thing from there.
If you respring the OE shock the damping will be wrong and there is no way to change it.

 

[Deleted account 191119001]

Spring rate is not the issue it is the relationship between that and damping, the TT shock will be damped to suit the spring and it is manually adjustable so you can set you own base setting and let the D-ESA do its thing from there.
If you respring the OE shock the damping will be wrong and there is no way to change it.

Ok think I have finally got it now, so spring only cannot be replaced the damper also must be replaced, only then will the wizard box understand what is going on, hope I am understanding correctly now.